Request for Feedback: Modifying the Guideline Prohibiting the Use of Groups for Commercial or Advertising Purposes
We would like your input on potentially modifying or removing the Guideline prohibiting the use of Yahoo! Groups for commercial or advertising purposes . Our original goal in establishing the Guideline against commercial use was primarily to prevent spammers from using Yahoo! Groups. We still intend to strongly enforce this prohibition but believe that the broad prohibition on no commercial or advertising use of Groups may not be the best approach. We have not made any final decisions and would need to figure out how it would work, but we wanted to get your input as we consider potential alternatives.
Here are the two changes we are considering:
POSSIBLE CHANGE #1: Removing Guideline # 6 (The ban against using Groups for commercial or advertising purposes).
POSSIBLE CHANGE #2: Adding a line to Guideline # 4 (Stay on topic) to let group owners know that if they post off topic commercial messages they may run the risk that it is considered spam, which is not allowed.
What do you all think of this proposal, do you have any concerns? Please share with us by posting in the comments area below.
Thanks!
Yahoo! Groups Team
Donna said,
October 30, 2008 @ 10:56 am
Sounds like a great idea to me.
I believe that the commercial use of groups is now so varied that it could be very beneficial and very attractive for many people involved with many types of activities and interests.
Basil "Lee" Lybrand said,
October 30, 2008 @ 11:04 am
I would not like to see commercials. Unfortunately a lot of commercials are mostly hype to hook your attention. False claims are not lies any more they are considered the proper way of doing business.
Denver said,
October 30, 2008 @ 11:14 am
Hi:
I like “possible change #2″ the most. There is just so much spam in groups, especially those where the owner/moderator has vanished (which I know this issue is being worked on about owners missing in action)…but the spam is just really getting worse.
I feel that first-time offenders should just be banned all together from using groups. There need to be stricter guidelines and stricter consequences. And, this is coming from someone who has been a group owner and moderator for TEN years…which includes ONElist, eGroups, and now YAHOO! Groups. I’ve pretty much seen it all, and the spam just gets worse. Something needs to be done!
Denver
Joe Quigley said,
October 30, 2008 @ 11:45 am
There are more than enough popup ads as there is!!
Please keep thegroups commercial free.
Thanks!
joanna said,
October 30, 2008 @ 1:33 pm
I use yahoo groups for my affiliates to communicate with each other. If you opened it up to commercial uses, I would close the group down and use another method for group communication.
mickey ceee said,
October 30, 2008 @ 1:35 pm
It about time that Yahoo got into the Big Time Blog/Group business. In order to bring in a lot of people you need Limited Comercial Content. You can not let it get like a flower bed. You must limit the commercial content and have no Porn. If you allow porn, you allow in a segment of society that already has their own sites. You must limit Yahoo to non adult business because the Supreme court has said that any community may set up standards. I go to Dance Clubs, but I don’t drink. I attend baseball games but I don’t play anymore. I love Basketball but I can’t play any more. I read Playboy but I don’t date the centerfold. Do you understand. Pornography has It’s place in our society, and I stand for free speech, BUT Yahoo is for everyone to converse and exchange ideas along with Blogs and News. Yahoo does not need Porn. I am sure there are Porn Stars who have email accounts. They would tell you that they want Yahoo left to all for regular, news, social,sports, worldwide, national, educational, college, and business content! Yahoo was the first and the best. It is time to expand Yahoo to cover individual News sites for its customers (ie newsvine, faithbase,) and keep it simple to set up, not complicated. Faithbase is idiot proof! Yahoo should remember that to keep things simple is to make things FUN. Yahoo is a simple and well known name. Let us expand into News Blogs that have easy access to all and a table of content by numer order or spelling order. Let Yahoo have the first easy to find BLOGS and NEWS emails with Posts to Blogs in the world. MSN just dumped its groups foolishly. Yahoo should pick it up the way they had it. There are too many news names out there. I use other accounts for business and I don’t like Yahoo taking an email off ,if it has not been used for 4 months. Yahoo must drop that concept and at least make it one YEAR of non-use. I have said all I want to! YAHOO, keep it simple BUT expand on YAHOO not move in another direction! Sincerely Mickey Ceee
Pete said,
October 30, 2008 @ 1:44 pm
I believe the rule should be revoked, with a new rule written up specifically stating what would be considered spam. It needs to be something in black and white. Any ambiguousness would just be a nightmare in administrating, you’d almost have to set up some kind yahoo mini court online, and have an arbitrator decide. You could call this person, the Spam judge, lol. Seriously though, The blanket rule in effect now is hurting groups. I know a lot of teachers like to use groups as a way for students to keep in touch and get messages out about homework and classwork, so I would imagine that would work great for a small business or workgroup also. I’d say as long as someone isnt directly using a group to sell something, it should be ok. maybe have a limit on how many spams show up in a group per month and if the limit is exceeded, the group gets canned. Good luck, whatever you decide.
melissa said,
October 30, 2008 @ 2:03 pm
I don’t think it’s a good idea. They get enough info to us anyway.. I’ve got a problem with internal_energy_plus. They not trying to sell anything, I,m sure, But I have no clue to what they’re are talking about so I guess i have to buy something with the 12 postures.I tried to get off the mailing list because I don’t like it, but i keep getting an e-mail saying ya’ll can’t do anything which is more irritating.
Gordon (Groups PM) said,
October 30, 2008 @ 2:15 pm
Lee/Joe/Joanna/Melissa:
Just to be clear, a change in guidelines would NOT mean that Yahoo! would be increasing the number of advertisements in groups. In fact, Yahoo! wouldn’t be changing anything.
What we would be doing by changing the guidelines is to make it clear to moderators that it would be ok for them to use Groups in a commercial fashion, as long as they were NOT sending spam.
So, for example, a local parents group would know that it’s fine to charge a membership fee before their members can access their Yahoo! Group or to have sponsors who they thank on their group home page. Or the owner of a small business would know that it’s ok for them to use Yahoo! Groups as the way to send their monthly newsletter.
Today, some moderators worry that the commercial use clause in the guidelines prohibits these kinds of uses of Yahoo! Groups, and our goal in changing the guidelines would be to make them more comfortable.
But to repeat, any change in guidelines would not affect the advertisements that Yahoo! displays in groups.
Harlis said,
October 30, 2008 @ 4:18 pm
No on change #1
Yes on change #2
I will stop reading if I must sort through commercial messages to find something meaningful
Dennis Harrison said,
October 30, 2008 @ 4:27 pm
As long as their is no PORN and if WE DO HAVE the right to approve and monitor - AND if we can get some revenue to help our CAUSE, if there is a CAUSE. Our cause is one to protect the CIVIL RIGHTS and receive reasonable, if hardly even fair compensation for the thousands of vIOXX victims/survivors who have had their legal rights of representation stolen right form under their noses. I would also wish ensure that the group owners are able to censure anything distastesful and have a wide latitude as such. While I would be willing to help Yahoo with revenue, as they are helping us, I would only vote for this if a fair division of revenue is agreed upon. Yahoo provides the means, we are providing the content. It can be a win-win if done right in my view. Thank you for providing the opportunity of input.
Sincerely
Dennis Harrison
AvPEG, RvPEG joint owner
Jet said,
October 30, 2008 @ 5:04 pm
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, and no on change one. In case you missed it NO!!!
I am tired of getting bombarded by the porn people inviting me to “use” their groups… Which of course or commercial in nature. Until Yahoo can actually police these groups then why open the door to more abuse. Keep it shut and police the laws you already have in place.
I like number two with a caveat. Does that mean we get Yahoo spies in all of our groups? How are you going to police this one?
Once again I say, police and enforce the rules you have in place now before you start mucking around.
DK
Rev Mary Miller said,
October 30, 2008 @ 5:35 pm
Well, I have to say this: 1. There is the amendment in the constitution that allows for free speech. Porn is another matter and so is recruitment that is not spelled out that ends up as a virus on your email account (spyware with a trogan last week).
2. Some groups depend on sales of homemade products that don’t get “air time” anywhere else and when they are among friend they have known for (in computerland years) a long time, it is a trust sales with paypal requirement. So to cut off this as “spam” would cut off barely thriving businesses that are one and two persons businesses just getting started without start up capital.
3. In the intro to the groups spelling out what is allowed by the monitor and being a ‘clear monitor’ on top of your rules, means those who violate the rules are out and sent to TOS.
4. Yahoo needs to be proactive. YOU need to take better action when directed by monitors or members of spaming or phishing to take immeadiate action. NONE of this BS of 50 questions that take 5-10 days to mess around. Even better would be a TELEPHONE number for us to call (in monitors only area) so we can directly deal with the problem switftly. The longer it takes to report, the faster they have to hide.
I would suggest you keep this in mind when coming to an action about what you want done with egroups considering that it is in our best interest and our sweat equity.
Thank You for your time.
MOC said,
October 30, 2008 @ 7:32 pm
I do not allow messages at my group unless I approve them. thus spam, porn, whatever, is all controlled. I think that if members want to sell things to each other, like photos of celebrities, that is good. There are lots of clubs for stars and if the fans could post for sale items, or for trade items, that would be good. What, if any, legal responsibility would I have as the moderator if the deal went “bad”?
Colleen said,
October 30, 2008 @ 7:47 pm
NOOOoooo. I have been using yahoo groups for years just BECAUSE they do not allow commercial advertising. Every Internet article I read, every e-newsletters I get, every personal email I receive (yep - even from family, read the little “Have you tried new AYZ email yet?” at the very end of them), my snail mail box, every TV show we watch, every radio show I listen to… all these past times that are meant to be relaxing bombard us with commercials. Please do not do this to yahoo, you will ruin it for so many of us who enjoy it. We will still see ads on other yahoo pages and of course all everywhere else on the Internet. Please let us keep one place commercial free.
As for commercial use… I see plenty of business-related groups already, usually used for commication purposes. I have no problem against such groups. Just be sure there are safeguards in place so scammers cannot create a phony group just to harvest email addresses. A group allowed just for commercial (advertising) emails though, NO. We can join their mailing lists on their websites. That’s opportunity enough.
marcus said,
October 30, 2008 @ 8:09 pm
This would be the dumbest thing yahoo ever did your tos and guidelines are fine.People who run their groups control this it’s the idiot’s who start a group then walk away from that you need to police not us we take care of are groups and when someone spams it we take care of it.
Case in point i started moderating a group because a owner couldn’t keep up with it and it was getting spammed so they asked the group for help.Like i said you do this and you’ll lose a lot of dedicated yahoo people.Don’t believe me go read the other yahoo blogs here http://ycorpblog.com/
bennett said,
October 30, 2008 @ 9:08 pm
Given the state of the economy, the collapse of yahoo shares, not to mention most of the equity markets, plus the pending demise of millions of small business, the 423% increase in BK’s for the age group 75-84, any process changes and rules reductions that led or inspired any enhanced development of commerce within communities, of which Yahoo groups are a form, would be a welcome change.
WE all need to survive, and surviving together in our communities is key, lest the WE that which stands once the current carnage is over, is solely chain stores and the government politburus that have taken over the failed companies that it qualifies for acquisition.
Times are perilous Obama or no Obama - and until the failed economic system that currently govern the world system completely fails, we must do everything possible to allow everyone to make money any way that we possible can. (subject to reasonable opt outs)
Good luck to everyone. The Storm is here and it is a doosey.
Liz said,
October 30, 2008 @ 9:52 pm
We have had a great time with the group as is, why fix it if it isn’t broken?
If you need to go some where else to get info–do so.
The group is good as is. Leave it be.
forexthinker.com said,
October 31, 2008 @ 12:43 am
I am in favor of limited advertising if it encourages participiation.
Mandy said,
October 31, 2008 @ 4:24 am
Mixed feelings about this.
I think it should be okay for people to use groups in a commercial way as clarified by you (Gordon) in the comments. *If they explicitly say so*, that is, it has to be blindingly obvious that a particular group may serve a commercial or advertising purpose, without doubt or grey zones. Also there needs to be a regulation that disallows advertising for a commercial group elsewhere. In other words, spamming elsewhere for a Yahoogroup would violate the TOS (for that group).
But I’m afraid you’re opening too many hidden loopholes by this which we don’t see yet. There is far too much spam around in groups now already, some claiming it isn’t spam because it’s in a group or the owner would allow it, some hammering out daily automated commercial announcements via group calendars, etc. - really all kinds of stuff. I guess people would increasingly take the opportunity to “spam” more, and in more ways, if there was more doubt about what would be allowed then under less tight regulations. That could get increasingly annoying, I suppose.
Dave said,
October 31, 2008 @ 6:49 am
I would love to see #6 go bye bye!! As I understand it, you still want to prevent unwanted spam, but now allow what amounts to commercial based groups. Allowing an owner to directly sell through a group to his members, or members to sell to each other. If there are members in that group, it would be obvious that they want to be there to buy, or they could simply leave! I am for it!! I happen to also be looking forward to the implimentation of one of your ideas, that of paid memberships!! I am on low income, and had been looking for years to be able to make a few bucks online, without shelling out mega bucks!! Doing it this way would not be considered spam, because the nature of spam is “unwanted” material, by members joining, it would be wanted…therefore not spam. It would not create more spam. Ppl put their groups links in theirs signatures now, they could still do that.
I just love this idea…and the money making paid membership one (are you working on a way to renew every month, lol?) !!! Way to go yahoo…nice to see it coming into the twenty first century!!
Why should all the corporations make the bucks huh?
selma said,
October 31, 2008 @ 7:09 am
Issue #1 - I am new to the group but I waited to make an offer as long as I did because I wanted to make sure this was a genuine reycle group — not someone phishing for ebay stuff, porn, or other special interest that I am not interested in. I think we should NOT allow commercial advertising. How many times have you signed up for a totally benign group and you start getting crazy emails. I for one am sick of it. I am an adult — if I wanted to go to a porn site I would. I don’t want it force fed to me because I was trusting enough to believe the privacy policy of a group’s site. Issue #2- are you going to be able to stay on top of this or will you enlist the help of each member to “report” what they feel is “spam” . It may get out of hand!!
I am not against making money. I would just like to do it in an environment that is clean and healthy — sort of what we are trying to do by recycling. Thank you for that opportunity and by the way I have met some really nice people thru your group.
Jaime said,
October 31, 2008 @ 8:45 am
I am not opposed to advertising, as long as it is appropriate and done in the correct media. I do not think that Yahoo Groups is the right medium for this type of activity. It will negatively impact my group members, and curtail their use of the group to communicate with each other. I can imagine how frustrated everyone will become because of unwanted e-mails, ads, messages, etc… that have nothing to do with why they joined the group in the first place. My vote is NO!
Cait said,
October 31, 2008 @ 12:48 pm
I don’t want to see any ads at all. I have enough on my Yahoo! inbox, and am tired of them. I know Yahoo! needs to generate income, but let our group sites be free of them.
Dave said,
October 31, 2008 @ 1:39 pm
Am I the only one that understands that yahoo is talking about allowing commercial use of groups (and also paid memberships) to generate income through a group? And not so much about ads and commercials…which is different then a commercial group…think business people!! I believe allowing commercial or business use of groups would be a great and awesome thing for all!! I say go for it!!
A least this is what I think they mean…correct me yahoo if I’m wrong?
Bill R said,
October 31, 2008 @ 3:39 pm
Lets clean up the way in which groups are created first before you consider allowing commercial content. It must be tougher for the group creation process. Email verification then a wait period of a few days, during which the group titles are searched for Spam type headers.
Is it just me or has any one else been hit with a deluge of request to join obvious “spammer” groups lately?
Here are some examples:
Yahoo! Groups: You’re invited! Join nyahadley27198170 today
kayleequinn27198158 moderator to (my email name)
Yahoo! Groups: You’re invited! Join nyahadley27198170 today
nyahadley27198170 moderator to (my email name)
Uncle MythMan said,
October 31, 2008 @ 7:39 pm
Makes me think of a sandbox-metaphor … all the kids visit the sandbox everyday, and an industry grows up out of the sandbox; that corner of the sandbox where the kids started out trading baseball-cards. If you look for ‘corruption,’ you COULD say they were planting greed in their minds; but really we ALL depend on the business (it’s what keeps the money flowing), so it’s really very healthy!
Temeculamom said,
November 1, 2008 @ 8:31 am
Bill R., yes, I just signed up for a new yahoo email recently, and I have been getting a few requests a day to join obviously bogus groups. The only place they could have gotten my email is from Yahoo. I do think groups should be allowed for commercial use, as long as spamming or recruiting emails to other groups is curtailed. I also think it might be a good idea to have two types of groups: unpaid groups for hobbyists, collectors, fans, groups of friends, etc. and paid memberships for commercial groups. It would be an easy way for colleagues to network with each other, and a paid membership could offer some additional benefits to the business user.
Leona P said,
November 1, 2008 @ 9:56 am
My group is a collecting group which migrated to YahooGroups from the original Yahoo Clubs concept. (BTW, I still feel very aggrieved that we are denied features afforded to then existing or newer YahooGroups such as Polls & the ability to change group policies–such as being able to switch everyone onto moderated status or to require display of an email address in order to join.) I wouldn’t mind the changes about commercial/advertising purposes as long as I could control the influence. As we are collectors, making contacts for buying/selling is part of what brings us together; explicit guidelines spelling out policy have been a part of the group for about 8 years, so I don’t feel this is an issue. Members may post that they have something for sale, but deals must be made in private email & there is a complaint & compliment procedure.
What DOES bother me is the “Grouply” service, which, despite its web site’s protestations to the contrary, does appear to violate the Yahoo TOS where it says “NO RESALE OF SERVICE–You agree not to reproduce, duplicate, copy, sell, trade, resell or exploit for any commercial purposes, any portion of the Service (including your Yahoo! ID), use of the Service, or access to the Service.”
Grouply sells advertising (& admits as much on its site) & that advertising is delivered to Yahoo members who have been sucked out of their groups into Grouply, thereby diverting & diluting Yahoo’s advertisers’ ability to reach its target audience. As a group owner, I object to our messages being exported to another service over which I have no control.
If Yahoo makes these changes, it seems to me that several of my anti-Grouply sentiments are shot down. Please don’t do this, or least be specific about what kind of commercial activities are limited. I am investigating how to eliminate Grouply from my group.
Beverly P. said,
November 1, 2008 @ 12:30 pm
hi everyone, Im all for it.if we dont support each other thru locall business, who will.plus there are certain controls and rules you can add.why not have this on the profile page only ,that way as members learn about each other, it would be up to the member to contact them .or start an ads page. but on our regular chit chat page I dont want to see them, best regards
Jet said,
November 1, 2008 @ 3:20 pm
Of course what we think doesn’t really matter as Yahoo will do as Yahoo pleases. This is just so much plabum, allowing group owners to think yahoo actually cares what we think.
So do whatever it is you will do yahoo, I for one will switch services if it is something I dislike or don’t believe in.
DK
Kenny said,
November 1, 2008 @ 7:38 pm
Why change the rules as Yahoo Head Office and Yahoo.co.id are not interested in doing anything about Kula Mataha with the email address matahak@yahoo.co.id spamming many Yahoo Groups with off topic commercials NOW.
Kenny said,
November 1, 2008 @ 7:39 pm
PS Removing the “POSSIBLE CHANGE #1: Removing Guideline # 6 (The ban against using Groups for commercial or advertising purposes)” prepared to get even more spam in The Yahoo Groups, thanks to Yahoo.
DIANE VERNIA said,
November 1, 2008 @ 7:47 pm
I AGREE WITH LETTING PEOPLE SELL TO EACH OTHER. AND I REALLY AGREE WITH KEEPING THE PORN OUT! THANKS FOR YOUR TIME, SINCERELY, DEV
Jeanetta Mastron said,
November 2, 2008 @ 2:15 am
I own Jeanetta’s PTCB Study Group and I do not allow any advertisement that is not pharmacy or pharmacy tech related and non that I do not approve of. I have used the choice # 2 by myself for 6 years very successfully.
I get spammers! so I made it moderated. I delete as spam all that are trying to sell vitamins, sex enhancers, sex toys and videos and non porn and porn. I keep them as members, because when I reject them they get anrgy and solicit the site worse than before! What this does is give me and members false membership numbers. But I find it gets worse if I retaliate by rejecting. by deleting as spam, I do not piss them off, they either leave the site when they realize they can not post freely or then stay on and keep posting from time to time. But since the posts are on moderate they never get in. I hate moderate because then posts are not in real time they are dependant upon when I get to the posting. But it solves the spammer problem.
I vote for number 2 because this internet is free and we should be able to use it to sell product or services.
I wishto take this moment to THANK YAHOO for being there to allow me a place to show case FREE tutorials for those studying to become a pharmacy technician. You run a great site/ship!
Thank you Yahoo!
Jeanetta Mastron CPhT BS
Jeanettas PTCB Study Group on yahoo site since 2002
Sherine said,
November 2, 2008 @ 3:52 am
Honestly I think that “The ban against using Groups for commercial or advertising purposes” in IWAI is ridiculous. I was in fact looking at a way to contact the appropriate person about this very issue. Lately there have been a few people that advertised about special events happening in and around Izmir and for some reason you sent out an apology email. I was very happy that those emails went through since the main reason that I joined the group was to hear about different kinds of events going on in Izmir that may be of interest to us Expats. There is honestly no other way for us to find out about them here in Izmir and I actually was relying on the IWAI to let me know about them. I really do hope that this ban gets removed otherwise I honestly have no reason to renew my membership.
Rose said,
November 2, 2008 @ 5:58 am
What about SPAM groups like angierachael28198022?
HarryLou said,
November 2, 2008 @ 7:21 am
I got an email invitation to join a group today. When I looked it up to see what it was, it was an advertising “page” for Viagra-type stuff — the kind of thing that comes to you as spam. Please do something to stop this. Thank you.
James said,
November 2, 2008 @ 11:02 am
Yes I agree that groups that may be some what of a commercial nature should be allowed, but I think they should still be required to run as a community as well, where it is not solely about the group owner posting ads to their products or affiliations..and also even if a group is commercial and the owner is a website owner that links back to Yahoo then this could be some type of equitable exchange..example I have links to Yahoo on my site and course have been p^issed a few times in the past when one of my groups got deleted and lost over 38,000 members after over 6 years of hard work promoting that group and Yahoo..and the only reason I could come up with since it was a active community type group that members used related to our field is the only reason it got deleted was due complaints from particular haters of what we do that complained continuously to Yahoo until finally they sent a complaint Yahoo did consider a violation and that had to be the seemingly commercial use violation.
Maybe even have a option that allows owner to indicate their group may have commercial relationships as well..??
But yes Yahoo needs to get in step with social networks that are allowing users more leeway related to this so Yahoo can start recovering many of the users that have abandoned Yahoo groups for Myspace and Facebook etc.
Yahoo had the drivers seat for years in the social concept and to me let it slip away.
Jo said,
November 2, 2008 @ 1:11 pm
Anonymity is essential to sharing within a group you do not see or meet in person. Privacy and grief go hand in hand. We get bombarded in all other areas of our lives with telemarketers, surveys on the phone, in our snail mail and even at our doors and spammers and pop-ups on the web. This group should be a safe haven where we can trust not being used or abused by commercialism. It would be awful if someone was only being nice and friendly for their own business/profit. Its different if you seek it by yourself. Please keep the guidelines as they are here.
thanks, Jo
M B said,
November 2, 2008 @ 2:15 pm
I think that adding commercial groups will make it that much harder for me to find the group I want to join. If it is hard right now to sift through all the non-commercial groups in order to find something in my area (Toronto) how much harder will it be once there are a large number of paying groups to search through. Most of the time the commercial groups are favoured and come up first in a search.
I realize Yahoo has to make money and they currently do this through advertising. If we must have commercial groups, fine but lets keep them very separate from community, not-for-profit ones.
Crazy mom said,
November 2, 2008 @ 6:06 pm
if you remove guideline number #6, you’re opening the door for much more spammed groups than there already is, and taking away the purpose of what groups are for. if people want to have a site for commercial or advertising purposes, they can buy their own domain.
Crazy mom said,
November 2, 2008 @ 6:19 pm
Also, if you plan to remove guideline #6, Yahoo better be prepared for all the scam complaints of being ripped off by Yahoo via a group. If there is no safe gaurds in place and monitored regularily, you’re just asking for trouble.
Susanne said,
November 3, 2008 @ 1:26 am
The two proposed changes would be great. Thanks for making our Yahoo groups even better.
Bradford Medicinehorse said,
November 3, 2008 @ 8:50 am
Yahoo!: I’ve read, or at least skimmed, all the posts relative to Y!’s proposal to allow *some* form of commercial email / content. I mostly agree with most folks. Option #1 should be rejected. Y! *must be* *very careful* in how this is set up. Y! should come up with a set of *proposed rules*, & post them for user’s comments, long before taking any action. Also, Y! should have in place, to the greatest extent possible, “contingency plans”, in case of a worst-case scenario. Then, *Let ‘Er Rip!…i love yahoo. Really i do! ~Bradford~.
Joycem said,
November 4, 2008 @ 2:35 pm
Not going commercial is fine but it’s definitely NOT preventing spammers. I’m getting spammed by various yahoo groups all the time.
Allan said,
November 5, 2008 @ 12:25 pm
BAD idea! Commercial use of groups has gotten WAY out of hand!
Another problem with Yahoo Groups is the reporting process.One reports groups that violate Yahoo’s Terms Of Service Agreement(TOS),and nothing is ever done about it.
Stuart said,
November 6, 2008 @ 3:18 pm
Heres a solution which represents a combination of both solutions.
Change guideline 6 to: You may not use Yahoo! Groups SOLELY for commercial or advertising purposes.
I believe this is the best representation of the intent of the group system - ie yoyu can use the groups to promote commercial sites - but that cannot be the primary aim.
bOb said,
November 6, 2008 @ 5:37 pm
No Ads! Period.
Between solicitations at work, at the mall, at the airport, on a Sunday walk, at the door, on the phone… for goodness sake. Not here!
Most of us who are savvy enough to even use a tool like groups have enough “awareness” of when we want to purchase something and how to go about finding something when we do.
If you must open the door for soliciting from withing groups, give the owner an option (and privilege) to say “Yay” or “Nay” to solicitations within their respective group(s).
Yahoo’s time is better spent fixing response time and rolling out Beta rather than ruminating on constitutional changes like they were some kind of elected official who feels “legislating to death” is a required state of existence.
Stuart said,
November 6, 2008 @ 10:22 pm
Yahoo Groups is meant to be a method of creating an on-line community. Within any community (online or otherwise) there is bound to be some commercial interest. How about a subtle change to the wording of rule #6 to something like:
Yahoogroups is designed to allow the creation of on-line communities; therefore you may not use Yahoo! Groups for purely commercial or advertising purposes.
John said,
November 7, 2008 @ 2:19 pm
HAHA yahoo asking our opinion - yeah right. Let me guess something right now, the bad will be lifted. If yahoo brings it up they are trying to figure out a new way to make revenue. Too obvious.
Brian M. Kochera said,
November 7, 2008 @ 3:14 pm
As a new moderator, I think that there should be clear guidelines.
These guidelines should delineate what is acceptable advertising and what is not within the context of the kind of Yahoo group.
Perhaps guidelines can be set up to address categories in which a particular group may fall. For example: Professional Networking would permit members to advertise products they sell, barter or trade, Family Private Communication (One must be a member of that family for membership), Arts and Crafts for Sale, Arts and Crafts as a Hobby.
Maybe it can be distilled down to groups that have a skill or product to sell, barter or trade. The alternative would be groups whose members wish to discuss some topic(s), share information but do not have something to sell, barter or trade.
Since, I join the latter types of groups, I feel there should be no advertising in such groups.
Brian MK a/k/a dhalgrin57
chris said,
November 10, 2008 @ 2:16 am
obviously, something has already changed…i get spammed at least once a day now from somebody asking me to join their yahoo group…i’m considering leaving all the groups i’m currently in…thanks a lot yahoo
Sandy said,
November 10, 2008 @ 10:18 am
As a moderator I do not allow advertisng unless it has been approved by me. And that is very seldom. And normally it is just to announce a new book they just releases or something that is very on topic) I’ve set up database so that our members can list their business (if it is on topic) and I really don’t want any other advertisng in the group. To give someone the option of opening a group and charging a fee is ok but I think that sets up another whole can of worms. There would always be those who opened a group, took money and then disappeared.
Every time I stop someone from advertising on my group I get many thank you’s for keeping the group clean.
And as far as the email request to join different groups, I think they are all SPAM. (According to my header they are NOT from Yahoo) If you go and look for the group itself, they never exist. So, just like other SPAM emails, don’t click anything and delete.
Dave said,
November 12, 2008 @ 2:11 pm
I actually have two questions now. Has a timeline been set yet for implimentation of commercial groups? Will you be able to convert an existing free group to a commercial one, or have to create one from scratch?
Thank you!
Evening Rain said,
November 13, 2008 @ 10:22 pm
Please - please - please!!!! We get enough spam as it is. The spammers always find a way of getting around rules and regulations as it is, and the porn bots do as well. They always find a way of getting spam to us. Consumers now have to purchase special programs to stop the spammers or keep it at a minimum as much as possible. I use Spam Cop and it works well, but the spam still manages to get through.
Let each group run itself and by the guidelines -without a TOS - Yahoo will revert to the old days which weren’t always the best when it came to Yahoo not enforcing their TOS. I’ve been around since One List - then egroups then when egroups and Yahoo combined and now we have Yahoo running the lists entirely, so I’ve seen a lot of changes. I like a lot of the new features, even if I may not use all of them myself and I think that unfortunately we must have some rules. Spamming rules are necessary and should be strictly enforced, when it comes to spammes, porn, that sort of thing. There are millions of places online that people can find porn, so why encourage it here?
I say you’re on the right track as it is - don’t let up on the spammers.
Joni said,
November 14, 2008 @ 5:22 am
An emphatic NO to the changes. If they are made I will have two choices and that is to ban all commercial posts and posters or the more likely choice will be to change providers. No one in my groups wants these. Also, “commercial” is very hard to define IMO. what is commmercial to one may not be to antoher. I also agree with other posters there are enough popups and advertismenst now. The message area keeps getting smaller and smaller with the ads as it is now.
Teresa said,
November 14, 2008 @ 1:16 pm
I agree with the majority of responders that keeping groups non-commercial is best.
However, I have no problem with Yahoo introducing a second type of group which allows some type of commercial activity.
These new, more commercial groups, should be CLEARLY marked as such when someone is searching for a group.
I also feel it would be easier for Yahoo to administer these two types of groups if they remain separate Yahoo services.
Anna said,
November 14, 2008 @ 6:07 pm
Hi!
I am glad I found this great opportunity to talk, share and ask. Coz’ I am very new here and have been running for barely around a month only. As a moderator, I find it nice and useful too, to share newly discovered websites or links to my fellow members who I think share the same passion, interest and concern as mine ( food related, particularly). And as a moderator of the group, I try my very best not to go out of topic, to maintain being a responsible and a wholesome mail sender. I think allowing commercials or advertisements is a good idea. I for example, have recommended to my co-members to check the InventNow.org or the Befiresmart.com to them. I know what are spams, and I am happy to say that I am not into it. Moreover, what are unsolicited advertisements for you; or how do you categorized them? Hopefully, if you now allow advertisements or commercials among groups, which I think is great!, may you continue to guide us closely and give good advises on what to advertise/endorse and what not to. I just want to be in track for I really find Yahoo Groups amazing. Thanks and More Power
!
Jennifer Springer said,
November 15, 2008 @ 2:29 pm
Here are the two changes we are considering:
POSSIBLE CHANGE #1: Removing Guideline # 6 (The ban against using Groups for commercial or advertising purposes).
–What does this mean? That anyone joining any group could post unsolicited advertisements? Two of my groups are for the members to advertise certain well defined items and services for sell. It was this way always and back when we were on eGroups and before that as well. So if it means that anyone could post random, off topics “ads” or spam, then I have to say NO. Absolutely not. Ours is an open membership group (currently) and I do not want to have to change it to moderator-approval for membership. We do moderator all messages for content, because we do limit what is allowed content on our group very strictly, to prevent spam and to be most effective to the members.
–What I need is a way to ban and/or remove a member who has posted a link, file, photo that is off topic at the same time I am removing the item; and/or a way to remove all content on the group belonging to member who is being removed or banned.
–In an effort to reduce spammers, I am now needing to require members to remain a member of the group if they want their content to remain posted for the group. So if you place a link or a post, you must be a member of the group or it has to go when you do. That would be a valuable service for me when having to remove violators.
–Another thing that would be most useful to me would be no allow members to put emails to “no email”, as there is very rarely a special announcement, but I need all moderator announcements to go to all members, regardless of their email status.
POSSIBLE CHANGE #2: Adding a line to Guideline # 4 (Stay on topic) to let group owners know that if they post off topic commercial messages they may run the risk that it is considered spam, which is not allowed.
–Again, having trouble understanding the meaning here. Define “commercial messages”. Again our group is all about posting sale or trade items and has always been that way, so not sure how this would apply to us. However, is this saying that somehow the group owner would be responsible for spam messages on their list? If my group rules clearly states that I, the owner, can change the rules and limit posts (or accept posts) as I see fit to run the group, how does this affect me?
Chatelaine said,
November 16, 2008 @ 3:14 pm
I think that any commercial venture that is completely owned and operated by a single “Member” of the group would be fine. Who wants to joine a group and get three pages a day of adds for Mary Kay, Tupper Ware or the like of that. If you make bird feeders or something of that nature, sure, bring it on and tell your friends about it. Just don’t wear me out trying to sell an additive that will give a 30% increase in fuel mileage. If I want to read about that sort of stuff, I just root through my junk mail folder.
james williams said,
November 16, 2008 @ 8:57 pm
rev.mary miller said“`
4. Yahoo needs to be proactive. YOU need to take better action when directed by monitors or members of spaming or phishing to take immeadiate action. NONE of this BS of 50 questions that take 5-10 days to mess around. Even better would be a TELEPHONE number for us to call (in monitors only area) so we can directly deal with the problem switftly. The longer it takes to report, the faster they have to hide.““`I agree with this.I belonged to a group for two days.a person that belonged to another yahoo group hit me up with a bunch of sexual links.I deleted all my profile .I started to get out of yahoo but changed my mind and stayed.I notified yahoo.They said we`ll check it out.I lost the moderator status and member.I rejoined.When is yahoo going to wake up.I complained to the group owner but not heard a word from him.
Dave Bird said,
November 19, 2008 @ 2:41 pm
I don’t mind commercial messages as long as they are pre-approved by the moderator, on an individual basis. Moderators know when/if the members would be interested in something offered for sale in the domain of interest of the group. Successful cases that I have seen typically do a one time only offer/info, but sometimes it becomes difficult when the topic goes to something covered by a vendor, for example a book that covers something under discussion. In that case the vendor-member is within bounds to refer the other members to buy the book for more detail, etc. I do not favor rigid guidelines across all groups because there is way too much variation between groups and member interests. Keep it under the control of the moderators as long as moderators have only fully transparent interest in the product.
Ellen R said,
November 19, 2008 @ 9:33 pm
My suggestions:
1. I would change #6 to read something like the following:
It will be the group owner(s) discression If advertisements, (of any sort). will be allowed in their group or not, and they will determine what is appropriate for their group.
2. The group settings (on the home page) should reflect if the group accepts or allows advertising or not, just as it now shows if attachments are allowed or not.
3. When searching for groups, an option to include groups which allow groups with ads to show up in the results, or not.
4. If a group is setup for the express or possible purpose of selling something, it should clearly say so in the group description. (You may have to increase the allotted # of characters to accommote this.)
RS said,
November 21, 2008 @ 10:29 am
My only concern is deceptive groups that would be set up and advertised as ‘cures for (x y & z)’ or singles hookup groups with a fee, that are actually membership collection scams. You’d a way to preview the content of the group so you know you are ‘buying in’ to something you really want. Perhaps a ‘atke a tour’ feature that allows the user to preview a few of the latest messages, home page layout, etc. Just saying ‘buyer beware’ would not be a responsible place for Yahoo to operate from. Leave some tools so users can protect themselves from the inevitable crop of scammers who are only in it for the membership fees. A ‘how to report fraud’ link to instructions, either easily located, or when signing up for such a group (or both) would seem essential so membership refunds and complaints could be handled without Yahoo’s involvement. A way to report scammer groups to Yahoo needs to be provided, and Yahoo needs ’stealth accounts’ t hat can go through the experience themselves and judge for themselves if its a scam, and shut down the group and report the scammer to the authorities.
With enough of these protections, it sounds fine.
Rene said,
November 30, 2008 @ 8:57 pm
Yahoo makes some of their money from advertising. Why let adult and porn sites advertise for free?
They are advertising for free now. They put links to their porn and adult sites on the home page for the specific group and then just abandon it. Other spammers come along and fill up the group messages with spam.
I even found a Yahoo group advertising a site oriented to making explosives and bombs.
A Yahoo employee told me there was a “report as spam” button on the home page for a group but I cannot find it. I also do not see a “report abuse” link on the group’s home page. There is also no “report as spam” button when viewing a group message on the Yahoo web site.
It sounds like Yahoo is just giving up when it comes to getting rid of spam.
There are so many bots that my ignore list is full in Yahoo messenger.
Harry Reinbolt said,
November 30, 2008 @ 10:42 pm
I do not the like idea of removing rule #6 because we are a group that is together for enjoyment, not business. I agree with the idea of changing rule #4.
Athena said,
December 1, 2008 @ 4:46 pm
I think groups should not be used for commercial purposes. There are far too many as it is now which violate the rules and spirit of groups I feel.
Curious about "membership fees" said,
December 4, 2008 @ 3:05 pm
What about groups that ask for a membership fee? I am a member of a Yahoo group for local alumni and the moderator has recently started asking for a $20 “annual membership fee.” Messages include a link to “pay your membership fee”. Just to be clear, the “membership” is strictly to receive the Yahoo mailings from other members, the group provides no other activities or benefits.
Is that OK by Yahoo’s current rules? Should it be OK going forward?
(IMHO, it feels weird, but I guess it’s up to you guys at Yahoo to decide how you feel about people profiting from your servers and sysadmins in this way.)
John Petrucci said,
December 4, 2008 @ 10:09 pm
Its Really A good idea, i must appreciate it.
Administrator said,
December 8, 2008 @ 12:15 pm
Thanks to everyone for sharing your thoughts and perspectives.
Since it appears that several of you may have misunderstood the proposal, I wanted to reiterate what Gordon shared above:
A change in guidelines would NOT mean that Yahoo! would be increasing the number of advertisements in groups. In fact, Yahoo! wouldn’t be changing anything.
We’ll consider all feedback we received and post our decision in the coming weeks.
Thanks again for weighing in with your thoughts.
Best,
Jami
Groups Community Manager
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